Okay, before I return to Bat-Talk, let me inform you, my two remaining readers, that due to a somewhat hectic week I am way behind on everything, and that includes the new End of Civilization post. I didn’t get a chance even to look in the new Previews ’til Sunday morning, so EoC will be later this week, most likely.
“I walked out of the Burton Batman movie ANGRY that Alfred let Vickie Vale into the Bat Cave. Alfred is a paragon of loyalty and would never reveal Batman’s true identity to anyone. I was legitimately ANGRY. My girlfriend was embarrassed. She dumped me not long after. She was probably right to do it.
“Liked Keaton. Didn’t like Nicholson. Have only seen the movie that one time.”
I was…sort of okay with that particular plot twist, even though I totally see your point as well. Since then, the “secret identity” trope has pretty much gone through the wringer in media adaptations (and in the source material, too, for that matter), and it’s become much less of an issue that it’s used to be. It probably has something to do with the lead character looking like kind of a jerk by keeping his/her secret from friends, and by giving the superhero a “support team” who are all in the action and making things more exciting, I guess. It really came to a head in the Flash TV show where it seemed like everyone knew he was secretly Barry Allen, except for Iris, and that made everyone watching just a little uncomfortable. Even Superman’s not free of this, since in Supergirl everyone in the Secret Government Alien-Awareness Patrol (SGAAP for short, since I can’t be bothered to Google up the actual name) seems like they’re in the whole Clark Kent deal.
Granted, that’s slightly different from Bruce’s trusted associate Alfred totally exposing the secret without any warning, but as a one-off plot point in one movie, in that Alfred is trying to do the right thing to help the man he’s protected his whole life…I can live with it. Anyway, she mysteriously “slips” and “falls” into an “unreachable” part of the Batcave between films, so the point is essentially moot.
To your final point, like I’ve said I do want to revisit the movie. I remember liking both Keaton and Nicholson, but I felt at the time Nicholson was maybe…too known a face to disappear into the role? Of course ol’ Jack was a big selling point of the film and may have got some fence-sitting butts into seats, so what do I know? Again, a rewatch is in order.
• • •
Thom H reveals
“I don’t remember where I saw the first Batman movie, but I do recall thinking it was kind of cheesy and watered down. I had really liked The Dark Knight Returns and The Killing Joke, and I remember thinking that everyone seeing the movie didn’t really ‘get it’ the way I did. I was ‘deep’ in high school, though, so most experiences were beneath me at the time.
“I did really like the soundtrack by Prince, especially the single Batdance, which has not aged well. And talk about cheesy. Yikes.
“I do remember seeing Batman Returns at the drive-in with my boyfriend. That’s when it hit me how big a deal the Bat-phenomenon was and how it probably wasn’t going away anytime soon.”
I’m assuming you saw that first Batman during its initial theatrical release? I suspect, since the release of newer Batman films, young folks encountering that first film in recent years may indeed find it kind of hokey (or, dare I say, “campy?”). But I wouldn’t be surprised in the slightest if you caught onto the goofier aspects of the film, since they’re definitely present…the argument can be made that this is more a Tim Burton film that happens to have Batman in it, versus a Batman film directed by Tim Burton. I think by and large folks who were worried about this sort of thing were happy that the film at least seemed dark and moody, versus the then wrongly-maligned 1960s Batman TV show they were all afraid the film was going to be. But then again, Dark Knight Returns was goofy as all get-out in parts, too, so, y’know, maybe Burt-Man wasn’t too far off the mark. Just needed more Mutant Gang Members!
I have to be honest and say I haven’t heard “Batdance” in a while, so let me have that play in the background as I tackle your next comment.
Batman Returns is as a good indicator as any of the pop culture staying-power of Batman, in that while the faddish aspects of Batmania had mostly died down, the film could still attract a general audience. Even the third film got people into theaters, and it wasn’t ’til the fourth film that people stayed away in droves, and that was clearly more from the fact the film was seen as a stinker, and not because people suddenly didn’t like Batman. Though like I said about the audience reaction to the Batman Begins trailer several years later (groans, and lots of them) everyone was still willing to give a new Batman film a chance. And of course through all this were the various animated incarnations of the character. Batman ’89 wasn’t just a one-time fluke, but rather it opened up whole new audiences for something that had mostly been over and done with as far as the “real” world was concerned.
Okay, back to “Batdance,” which reminded me that, aside from Dio’s “The Last in Line,” which is amazing, all music videos are stupid. Yeah, even as someone who appreciates Prince’s extensive catalog of fine recordings, “Batdance” is just, um…well, I certainly hope Prince put whatever money he made on that to good use. Frankly, I’m surprised the ’60s TV show-style “BATMAN!” call-outs were allowed, since I seem to recall an effort to avoid such references as to not impugn the dignity of this serious cinematic endeavor. And okay, that half-Batman/half-Joker look of Prince’s is iconic. Iconic of what exactly, I don’t know.
• • •
GE charges in with
“What always comes to mind for me was something you mentioned previously: popular doubts (at the time) that Mr. Mom could play Batman. Which is strange, to say the least, since the only live-action Batman most of us knew before then was Adam West, who certainly didn’t get all dark and grim and gritty. It was probably the influence of The Dark Knight Returns (et al) that put that doubt into the zeitgeist.”
That’s…a good point, actually. Dark, Gritty Batman was a relatively new-ish development in the comics, after decades of Swashbuckling Batman, or Time-Travel Crimes on Venus Batman, or Just Plain Ol’ Superhero Batman. I mean, the ’60s TV show wasn’t that far off from the source material, when you get right down to it. I suppose the case could be made that Golden Age Batman stories were a lot more grim than in following years, but that’s probably not what those fans were thinking about when they insisted this new Bat-film accurately reflect the Dark Avenger of the Night that they all knew and loved. The immense popularity of Dark Knight from just a couple of years prior was, as you say, likely the prime mover for that response, despite Dark Knight itself having strongly satirical/parodic overtones.
“Those doubts about Keaton culminated in a parody of Escape Club’s “Wild West” that kept playing on a morning radio show (probably Scott and Todd on 95.5 WPLJ in the NY/NJ market – don’t know if it was theirs, or they just played it…?), titled ‘Adam West’ and poking fun at the idea of Keaton taking over the cowl and cape. Big Bro even taped it off the radio (y’know, the way we used to have to do that, with a boom box and all!), and I’ve got the MP3 of that recording right here – we spent the last few years scanning/transferring everything we had (video, audio, drawing, writing…) to modern digital formats.”
As an avid Dr. Demento listener in my youth, I knew that particular song sounded familiar, and sure enough, here it is. Someone decided to add visuals to the song, but in this case it’s okay, because it’s Best Batman. So I guess that’s two music videos that aren’t stupid.
“Although many of our friends were worrying about whether the titular ‘Mr. Mom’ could pull it off, my brother and I weren’t worried — the previous year, we went to a screening of ‘Clean and Sober’ specifically to vet Michael Keaton as a grim actor.
“What a pair of nerds.”
Okay, nothing to do with the Batman movies, but I did something a little similar, in that in the mid-1980s I heard Shawn McManus was going to illustrate a forthcoming issue of Saga of the Swamp Thing (this one, in fact) and I wanted to know just what that was going to look like, since I wasn’t familiar with his art. I ended up buying something current with art at the time…don’t remember what it was, but it was a title I didn’t regularly read…and looked it over to reassure myself that he’d be at least okay at drawing my favorite character.
And of course McManus ended up being one of my favorite comic book artists, what with his run on Omega Men starting about a year later, and his Dr. Fate, and Sandman and so on. See what my approval can do for you!
Hoo boy, I opened up a real can of worms on this one. I’m going to be commenting on comments to my comments for this particular set of theme posts for the rest of time…though realistically I’ll have to cut off the discussion somewhere, or I can just go ahead and change the site name to “Batgressive Ruin.”
Anyway, let me at least wrap up the comments from the very first post:
Chris G presents:
“I was 14. I wore a Batman t-shirt on the end-of-year class trip to Hershey Park and kids in my class who I barely knew were asking me where I’d gotten it. I saw it twice on opening day and bought a poster of Jack Nicholson’s Joker sitting on a beach that hung in my room for years. The Prince ‘Batdance’ song was everywhere. And it was a HUGE thing when the movie arrived on VHS less than six months later, priced to sell to consumers rather than to video stores – that had never happened before and was the beginning of a sea change in home video.”
Since I was a big Oingo Boingo fan at the time…well, okay, still am…I remember being slightly put out that Prince’s Batman “soundtrack” (with songs “inspired by the film” if I remember correctly) was being released first, while the actual score of the the movie, composed by Boingo frontman Danny Elfman, was coming out much later. A silly thing to be concerned about, I realize, especially since I totally understand now that “NEW PRINCE ALBUM” was definitely going to sell better. Also, Prince is amazing. But Elfman’s soundtrack is good, too, and practically immortal given how many times they’ve reused that theme. There’s room for both, Mike of 1989! Don’t be so uptight!
The VHS thing…I remember getting myself put on a waiting list for the VHS release of Batman at…$20, I think, which was pretty reasonable for the time. I could have sworn there were some videotape releases prior to this that were a tad more consumer-friendly pricewise, and this Straight Dope discussion (and this article linked from there) do mention a number of attempts at consumer pricing on some films in the early to mid-1980s. There were still plenty of $100+ VHS tapes being sold to stores for rental purposes, of course, and what exactly constituted “affordable” pricing encompassed a wide variety of options. (I remember asking a friend at a video store to look into any videotape releases of the original Land of the Lost, and he found a couple of tape, each with two episodes, at I believe $39.95 each…this may have been late ’80s/early ’90s.)
It’s possible the relative cheapness of the Batman home video release, and subsequent popularity, may have been the impetus to push more and more VHS out into the market at reasonable pricing. Plus (and I’ve heard this argument a few times in the past) pricing the tapes down may have lowered piracy, as the hassle of having to patch together two VCRs to record a rental from the local video store may have been worth it when prerecorded videotapes were $100 a throw, but at $20 or so it was less of a pain in the ass just to straight up buy a copy.
“I was almost 7 when the movie came out. It was a revelation. I knew the Adam West show from reruns but this is something else. Everything was so serious, expressive and dramatic, even the silences. There were things that weren’t explained that made it intriguing. I must have seen it five times begging anyone who was willing to take me.
“I didn’t start reading the comics at this point. My grandmother volunteered at a library and gave me a copy of ‘Batman & Other DC Classics’ which reprinted excerpts of comics to convince people to try buying collections. And I loved that comic but it didn’t convince me to start picking them up regularly. Instead I was buying toys and stickers and buttons. And then, the VHS tape which I nearly wore through. I still occasionally think ‘you can’t watch a Warner Bros. movie without a Warner Bros. ballcap.’
“And as huge as Batman was, it’s worth noting there were a lot of big movies in 1989. Consider that Batman came out the same day as Honey, I Shrunk The Kids (5th highest box office of 1989) and a month after Indiana Jones and the Last Crusade (2nd highest). Every year has its share of classic movies but 1989 was stacked. Check out the full list since there’s too many to mention here. All these movies combined to give 1989 had the highest box office ever (without inflation) and wouldn’t be topped until 1993. And Batman was the biggest of them all.”
I can imagine the sort of impact this film would have had on a small child. A lot of it was super weird and creepy and I can imagine it frightening little kids…and fascinating them, as you say, Adam. That’s the right age to sort of absorb all this stuff at face value, without worrying about or even noticing the undercurrents of humor and self-parody involved.
I remember that Batman & Other DC Classics preview comic…probably still have one in my collection somewhere. And it seemed like for years at the previous place of employment I kept turning up copies. Gave away a whole lot of those…it was a nice little sampler.
And it’s funny that you point out 1989 at The Big Movie Year…for us just slightly older folks, 1984 is the year that always gets singled out as the Year o’The Hits…but I have to tell you, just browsing each year for the 1980s sure pulls up lots of formative films for a young Mike (though I don’t recall seeing this one on any Top Lists there).
• • •
And Jason has this to say
“I can only chime in as a film fan, because I don’t remember what I was reading in 1989. (I honestly think it was Captain America and not Batman!)
“When I say Batman was one of the darkest films I ever saw, I mean that quite literally. I saw it at a Drive-in as a kid, and and some scenes were simply too dark to decipher what was happening on screen. That bit where Vikki wakes up and Bruce is hanging upside down like his namesake? I didn’t see/comprehend that until I saw it again on video.
“I can’t think of any other movie that plays so fast and loose with the color black. Are super hero movies lit differently than ‘regular’ movies? Does anyone know offhand? Or are there simply more night scenes in super hero movies?”
Well, drive-in projection as I recall wasn’t the best for lighting and color nuance…I remember seeing that first Nightmare on Elm Street at a drive-in and it was a little hard to make things out in certain scenes. It could also be a problem with the actual physical projection…I know a theater local to me was having real problems with brightness levels on movies. That recent Harry Potter spin-off the name of which I can’t remember and don’t feel like Googling, for example, was nearly pitch black in some parts, and Rogue One, even in the scenes that were clearly supposed to be in bright, sunny daylight were desperately underlit by the projectionist. The theater improved since then, but I’m still reluctant to attend a flick there.
I don’t know enough about lighting or cinematography to intelligently answer your question about how they’re specifically doing superhero films…but not every film is mired in darkness. Spider-Man: Homecoming is nice and brightly lit…even in the night scenes, everything is clear as day. Occasionally I feel like dark shots are in our superhero moving pictures to conceal some dodgy special effects or CGI (something that occurred to me during at least one Harry Potter film). But man, of course Batman was filmed with lots of the color black…he is the Dark Knight, after all!
But seriously, I need to see that film again. Y’all are making me want to pop it back into the player.
And so BAT-MONTH CONTINUES…okay, maybe it won’t be the whole month, but I am still going back and addressing some of your comments to my previous posts (1234). I’m not addressing every single comment made, but if I skip yours, I still like you, I just didn’t have anything to add.
AWAY WE GO:
Bryan sez, he sez
“My recollection is probably skewed because a comic book store opened within a ten minute walk of my house in the spring of 1989, so I could suddenly go all the time, but I certainly remember ‘The Many Deaths of Batman’ (John Byrne and Jim Aparo! Together!) and ‘Legends of the Dark Knight’ (I don’t even want to think about how many different colours of that first issue I bought) and the ‘Arkham Asylum’ graphic novel, and the computer-drawn Batman GN that was heavily promoted, made the summer to late fall of 1989 feel like something huge was happening with the character, and DC was really able to piggyback the success of the movie to make me want to buy anything Batman.”
So I’d been wondering, since we last spoke, about whether or not I was overstating how huge of an impact that first Burton Batman made. Keep in mind at the time I was only about 20 years old, give or take, and thus squarely in that demographic Makers of Big Blockbuster Films prefer to target, and also I was, y’know, working in a comic book store, so maybe my awareness of said Bat-film was somewhat predetermined.
Now a lot of your comments seems to be supporting my asserting that the Batman movie was huger than a huge thing that’s huge, at least as far as cultural influence goes, so it’s not necessarily my biased memory coloring my recollection of history. One specific thing I remember is hearing radio deejays chatting about Batman and Batman comics and whathaveyou between songs…you know something’s big when Richard Blade is talking about Dark Knight Returns during his KROQ shift.
And yes, Bryan, as you say, DC Comics wasn’t bein’ run by dummies…they were squeezing every Bat-cent out of the character that year and pumping out all kinds of stuff to exploit interest in the character. The “computer-drawn” graphic novel was Digital Justice, and people sort of derided it at the time (while still selling well in the way all Batman was selling well), but I guess that book had the last laugh since computers are used in pretty much every aspect of comic creation now. And comics fandom. In fact, a computer is writing this very blog right now beep boop.
Some of those other books bring back a few memories of the time, too: like first issue of the “The Many Deaths of Batman,” which was dialogue-free except, I believe, for the very last page (or panel), which actually caused a customer to call the shop after he got home and read the issue, believing it was somehow misprinted and all the captions and word balloons were left out. Well…that sort of wordless storytelling was pretty unusual in superhero comics (though the famous G.I. Joe silent issue was about five years previous), so I guess I can’t blame the person too much.
The different covers on Legends of the Dark Knight was one of the early examples of multiple-cover variants in the industry, and at a time when nobody was quite used to the idea, the reactions were very mixed. There were the folks mad that they had to buy one of each version to keep the collection complete. (Keeping in mind the only difference was border colors.) There were the folks asking which one was the rarest, and therefore destined to be the most valuable. There were the folks who just thought the whole thing was a scam. And so on. Still sold of lot of them.
The Arkham Asylum graphic novel was greatly anticipated, and we had a waiting list at the shop that I can almost still mostly picture in my mind. I mean, not the names on it, of course, but I can still remember pulling that sheet out and adding names and phone numbers to it on a relatively regular basis. I was still going to college at that time, and working at the shop in the afternoons, so on the day of release, between classes, I got on a payphone (hey, it was 1989) and called the shop to make sure those jerks held a copy of the book aside for me. Guess I should have added myself to the waiting list. More fool I.
• • •
Jack notes
“My local comic shop, which had been doing okay but not world beating business, had a massive uptick in business. So big, in fact, that they moved out of the tiny location they were in to a much bigger one across the street, where they still are to this day. (They survived the 90s crash by pivoting to card games, and were ahead of the curve big time on the Pokemon phenomena.) Saying that the country had Batmania in 1989 is not an exaggeration, if anything it doesn’t do it justice.”
I believe it was in the very next year, 1990, that the shop moved across the street to its GINORMOUS location, easily 3x the size of the little shop we were moving out of, and we would never, ever fill up, never in our wildest dreams…so of course a few years later we completely outgrew that location and moved into a spot twice as large next door, where the shop still exists now.
In 1990, the boom was still booming. In, I believe it was 1997 when we made that final move, the business was…well, the crash had crashed, but I think things were slightly improving at the time. At the very least, we had adjusted to this new post-crash comics economy and were more or less ordering, planning, and spending accordingly. Plus, a full half of the store was dedicated to gaming (role playing and Magic: The Gathering) and that certainly helped the cash flow. Like Jack mentions about his shop, having differing stock lines (like the card games) at our store helped us ride out the lean years, though we still attracted plenty of comics business simply by reputation of having a large selection of new and old material.
I’m guessing the ironic result of Batmania was in encouraging stores to expand like we did, only to have the following market crash leave owners with newly-expanded locations they could no longer support. We were lucky that we were able to muddle through as well as we did.
• • •
Longtime customer and pal Casie (to whom I probably sold comics when she was 11!) relates
“I was 11 when the movie came out. Only read a couple Batman comics at that time but only knew the Adam West version which was colorful and fun. Had no idea what to expect from the 1989 movie. The whole dark side of Batman was new to me. After seeing it I was smitten.”
And related, from Dean:
“From what I remember as a tiny child at the time (I was 12 years old) this ‘dark, serious’ take on Batman was HUGE. This was before we realized that Burton Batman was just as goofy and stylized as Adam West Batman, just with the lights turned down.”
I think that was one of, if not the major elements, to what attracted people to this movie, that we would finally be getting the dark and grittyAvenger of the Night we deserved this whole time, the one we knew from the comics, and not that silly old TV show Batman. And like Dean says, these Burton films are camp in their own way (or rather, they’re Tim Burton films more than they’re Batman films), but there are still moments of darkness mixed in with all the goofy stuff. When we first see Batman capture those ruffians, with his gruff “I’M BATMAN” — it’s been mocked a bit since then, sure, but it’s still an effective introduction to the character. And that scene in the “doctor’s” room, pleading with Napier that he’s done all he could, just look at the tools he has to work with (quick shot of bloodied knifes and other instruments), the swinging lamp, only seeing Nicholson from behind…it’s a nightmarish scene, probably the best in the film.
The sequel, Batman Returns, is notable for turning up the darkness — turning down the darkness? you know what I mean — maybe a bit too much. There were complaints about the Penguin maybe being a little over the top in grotesquery, for example. Can’t say if the inherent goofiness in the film was also increased accordingly, as it’s been a while since I’ve seen either film. I’ll have to put that on the list of things to do When I Have Free Time, Maybe After I Break A Leg or Something.
So I’ve been looking back at your memories of the first Batman film from 1989 and all the surrounding hooplah (here and here and also here) and yeah, a whole lot of what you folks have been saying sure rings true with what I remember of my experience at the time.
I’m going to respond to the last comment I received first, from Andrew, who asks:
“Does Ralph remember any effect like this for the earlier Superman movies? What happened for subsequent Batman movies?”
I’ll ask Ralph when next I speak to him…he opened his own store in Ventura in 1980, but he was working with a partner at a shop in Santa Barbara for a few years prior to that, and working comic conventions and swap meets, too, so he probably experienced the response (or lack thereof) to that first Superman film in 1978. I’ll get back to you on that.
As far as the following Burton-Universe Bat-films go…well, it was diminishing returns, of course. The excitement over that first Batman movie was because it was “new” and “different” wasn’t there when Batman Returns hit in 1992, since we kinda knew what to expect now. I mean, obviously the film did well, and DC Comics did their best to exploit Batman during that period, but it’s not like DC wasn’t going to try to sell Batman comics, right? However, in 1992 the Bat-fad and the related comics boom had mostly run its course, and the comics crash was on its way, and the hordes of people who had suddenly discovered comic books in the late ’80s/early ’90s were beginning to find other things to do, so we weren’t going to have anywhere close to the cultural impact with the follow-up movies that the original Batman film had. Again, that second film was a blockbuster, and tie-in products sold well…but it wasn’t the culture changer its predecessor was.
The third film…I can’t remember if that had much of an impact at all. There was some slight interest because the lead was recast, but I don’t recall anything unusual aside from the typical merchandising one might expect from a Big Movie. And the fourth film…well, I’ve mentioned this before, but when I first saw the trailer for Christopher Nolan’s first Bat-film, Batman Begins, people in my theater literally groaned when they realized what they were seeing what a come-on for a new Batman film. Given that under normal circumstances the general public might be more positively predisposed to Batman, I most attribute that reaction to the trailer to memories of Batman and Robin, even if it was a whole eight years prior. That film cast a long shadow, however, which meant Batman Begins had a bit of an uphill battle to convince moviegoers that hey, maybe a Batman film can be good again.
Ooh boy, this is going to be a wordy post. Let me address a couple more questions and then we’ll continue into parts 2 through about 19 or 20:
James G. reacts to a non-Batman aside I made about the comics boom, noting
“I didn’t know about the sports card market crash helping the comic speculation market.”
Well, honestly, this was my assumption that I had at the time, and one I never really questioned or thought about much, so I can probably be refuted by someone with “knowledge” or “facts” or any of that wild stuff. But as I have related many times in the past, during the comics boom I had many people coming into the store asking after “comic book Becketts,” “Beckett” being the primary publisher of sports card price guides. That became a sure indicator of someone from the card collecting hobby, or at least familiar with it, trying their hand at the ol’ funnybook game.
I wasn’t really involved in the sports card market, beyond Ralph carrying a few boxes of this and that, so I don’t know a whole lot, but it was my understanding, from Ralph and some of his friends who did run sports card shops, that the card market, much like the comics market, was way overproducing at the time. I did a little Googling and did find, for example, this article that seems to corroborate those memories. It would seem that the card market preceded the comics market in its collapse, allowing some time for collectors of one to try to switch over to the other. That’s certainly what it seemed like what was happening then, but if anyone has more specific recollections, please let me know! All I know for sure it’s pretty tough to find a sports card shop around our area nowadays.
Patrick recalls
“People would be shocked at how Batman and Joker shirts were EVERYWHERE. And so many of them you would see see the same one twice in a day on people. And they were on a lot of people.”
Preach it, brother. Okay, I was working in a comic book store, so it’s only natural that I’d see lots of people in Bat-shirts. But when I would occasionally slip my chain and venture out into the wilds of Ventura County, yes, Bat-clothing was all over the place. Little kids, grandmas, the occasional nun, everyone was into Batman. Like I said in my own recollections of the time, we had waiting lists of people special ordering specific Bat-shirt designs.
The fad had to run its course eventually, and all those Batman shirts got put into closets one final time, never again to see the light of day. I can’t remember ever noticing the frequency of Bat-fashion declining…it was just something that was always there, background noise, until one day it wasn’t.
Okay, Bat-shirts aren’t gone forever…outside the peaks of 1960s and 1980s Batmania, incidence of Bat-clothing returned to its normal levels. But I wonder what happened to all those millions of Batman shirts that were purchased during that most recent boom time. Thrown out? Donated to Goodwill? Buried deep in a box in a closet for the original owner’s children to discover and wear as some kind of retro get-up? I bet if I dig into my closet, I probably can still find my own Batman t-shirt from the time, if only because I don’t clean old clothes out of my closet often enough. …Hey, my MC Hammer pants are back in style now, right?
• • •
As promised we’ll continue Bat-memories on Monday, same Bat-time, same B–okay, sorry sorry. But that means there’s still time to add more of your own!
“If you had unlimited funds, what’s the one thing you’d add to your store? Signage? Fixture? Ice sculpture? Water slide? Something more/less ridiculous?”
Crazy idea: movie theater. I have two rooms in the back of the store, and I can store stuff in the smaller room, and use the larger part of the backroom as an indoor theater of sorts. The walls would need repainting, and I’d need to cover that concrete floor with something, but that’s a lot of space that needs some using. Plus, I’d have to look into what sort of licensing I’d need to have in order to screen films, and some reasonable form of air conditioning that wouldn’t be too loud…but I could probably seat, I don’t know, a couple dozen people back there? It’s something to think about.
More realistically, I could knock out part of the wall that divides the store between the front and the back, and expand into that larger backroom area with more fixtures and products. “WELCOME TO MIKE’S COMICS AND POGS” the sign in front of the store would boldly declare to all passerby.
“As I recall, every iteration of the team had substantially the same origin: the Legion of Superheroes started as three kids from different planets with different powers joined together to combat the powers of evil in the 30th/31st century.
“But why would anyone dub the founding trio of Rokk Krinn, Imra Ardeen & Garth Ranzz ‘the LEGION of Superheroes?’
“A Roman legion was a unit of 3,000–6,000 fighting men. Even colloquially, ‘legion’ is synonymous with horde, throng, multitude, host, crowd, mass, mob, gang, swarm, flock, herd, score, army. No matter how you slice it a ‘legion’ is a whole bunch of folks.
“While the group would certainly merit the name in the end — including everyone from Bouncing Boy to Invisible Kid to Quislet to another Invisible Kid — at the founding no one could have know that. It was just three people.
“Within the continuity of the story, ‘Legion of Superheroes’ simply made no sense as the name for the original trio!
“And so my question: Has this ever bugged you?”
No.
• • •
Thom H. inquires about
“I love reading stories about customers. Can you share a good story about a memorable customer, whether it’s good, bad, weird, surprising, or something else?”
I’ve had several memorable customers over the years, but aside brief, amusing (or occasionally aggravating) incidents, I have a hard time relating actual stories about them, I mean, I have written about a couple of longtime customers who had passed away (like Errol, or Bruce, or Sean and his tragic end – they did end up catching the guy who killed him).
There was the fellow who always wrote enormous checks for expensive comics, the only personal information on his check being his name…my old boss had been dealing with him since long before I worked at the shop, and he always told me “the check’s fine, don’t worry about it.” And, far as I know, his checks always were fine.
There was the kid who collected Adam Strange comics…because his name was also Adam Strange.
There was the time, shortly after I started working in comics retail, when the shop was suddenly filled with lady wrestlers all in costume. I was like “is this what selling comics is going to be like all the time?” And the answer to that was, of course…yes, yes it was.
There was the young lady who’d been coming to the shop since she was a kid…and now, college age, she had come to the store and asked me if I wanted to see her new tattoo. I said “sure!” and before I knew it she had basically removed her top with her back to me, presenting her new full-back tattoo in all its glory. (Coworker Sean, who was working on the other side of the store at the time, later asked me “what the hell was going on over there?”)
There was the teaching assistant at the college I was attending who found out I worked in a comic book store, and would request comics that I’d bring up the next day that he’d then pay me for.
There was customer Marlon, who dressed as the Milestone character Icon one year for Halloween, and as the John Stewart Green Lantern another year, in absolutely perfect costumes with the perfect physique. It’s like the characters had literally come to life in our store.
There was the fella researching vampires in comics, and was trying to buy every single comic featuring a vampire appearance. On one visit we stayed for hours after closing assembling his several-thousand-dollar purchase.
There was MC Chris, who stopped by the shop prior to performing at the local music venue, and proceeded to plug the store onstage.
There was the time I thought John Ritter was just some creepy guy planning to shoplift from us.
Those were all at the previous place of employment. I’m trying to come up with any really unusual stories from the new store, but aside from the endless repetition of “this is just like Big Bang Theory!” I haven’t had any really weird stories burn into my brain yet. I’ve had lots of great, friendly customers who have been very supportive, I’ve also had the occasional time waster or problem creator (like the mom who was upset that I made her pay for comics her children destroyed…and to this day, when she passes by I here her tell her kids “no, you’re not going in there”). Or the elderly gentleman who just did not seem to understand that, no, I didn’t want to carry the sports jerseys he was wholesaling.
But I don’t want to focus on the bad things, really. I prefer to think of the helpful folks, like customer Mark, whom I’ve met since opening my new shop, who will occasionally show up at events at my store (like Free Comic Book Day) dressed in his great Batman costume and entertaining the other customers.
Or the mom who told me that her little girl loves Squirrel Girl comics so much that she takes them to bed and sleeps with them at night.
I haven’t had anything really epically strange happen yet…mostly just nice people buying comics nicely and doing nice things. …PLEASE DON’T TAKE THIS AS A CHALLENGE, ANYONE READING THIS.
• • •
Oh, okay, back to MrJM’s question…no, I never really thought about it, to be honest. Looking back at the Legion’s origin as presented in Superboy #147, I don’t see where it’s established who names the team thusly. Given that the fella financing the team, R.J. Brande, is responsible for naming two of the founding members “Lightning Lad” and “Cosmic Boy” (and probably named “Saturn Girl” as well, though not explicitly stated), it’s likely fair to say Brande dubbed the team “The Legion of Super-Heroes,” too. Calling it a “legion” from the get-go is surely Brande anticipating that new members would eventually join…and it’s probably also just simple marketing. “Legion” sounds impressive. “The Three Kid Band of Space Heroes,” not so much. R.J. Brande is the richest man in the 30th Century…he knows how to sell stuff!
• • •
So long to Flo Steinberg, original member of the Marvel Bullpen, who passed away on Sunday. She was just as much a part of the team as Stan, Jack and Steve, and Marvel wouldn’t have been Marvel without her.
Several years ago a bunch of comics folks were swapping mix discs, and as a “bonus” at the end of my disc was a recording of a Merry Marvel Marching Society record that I digitized from a copy of the flexidisc that had turned up in a collection. I later heard from, I believe, Fred Hembeck, who thanked me for including that on there. “It was so nice to hear her voice” he said. It sure was. That gal had character to spare!
So longtime readers remember how I love buttons. Hoo boy, do I love gathering pinbacks of all kinds to admire and display. Of late, my button acquisition has slowed down a bit, as I haven’t had the time to properly maintain the collection, though a few here and there still end up in my hands just as a matter of course.
I bring this up because I recently purchased a run of the British Warrior magazine, famous of course for being the initial home for the Marvelman revival and V for Vendetta, early and important works by writer Alan Moore (with artists Garry Leach and David Lloyd, respectively). Included in the batch was a copy of the Marvelman Special, which I’d previously discussed on this site at length several years ago (though honestly it feels like I just did so…time flies, and all that).
I didn’t mention it at the time, but was reminded of it again looking at this other copy of the magazine that appeared in this collection…there is a great ad for buttons (or “badges,” if you prefer) on the back cover:
…featuring several of the properties that have been appearing in Warrior. My eyes of course immediately went to the swell batch of Marvelman pins that I would love to get my greedy mitts on, down there in the bottom row. I went looking on the eBays and found nothing, though I did find this pic via Google image search, and I hope the person who posted it on this message board doesn’t mind me using part of his (or her, I don’t know!) pic here:
Those are some snazzy pins, and would look great on my blazer or my beanie. Alas, all I have is this ad to remember them by (though pal Davesuggested I make them into pogs, and I don’t know if I should thank him or hate him for even bringing that up).
I also found the Axel Pressbutton badges to be amusing, particularly since they come in “clean” and “blood-splattered” variations:
I’m going to guess that anyone who actually wore one of these was poked right in the pinback several times a day. Probably had a good bruise beneath by the time the poor sap got home.
And if you haven’t thought about Zirk in a while, don’t you think it’s time you have?
Speaking of Marvelman pins, like I was just a moment ago if you remember, I was reminded of the button released by Eclipse Comics back in 1986, back when they were handling the character (under the Marvel Comics-enforced name of Miracleman). Under the thrall of Mr. Moore and of Miracleman as I was, combined with my long-existent love of pin collecting, I of course had to have this item, which I wore on my jacket and/or backpack to high school, to such admiring calls of my classmates as “who the hell is that?” and “hey, get a load of the dork!” Anyway, 31 years on, I still have the button in my possession, and though I featured a tiny little scan of it on this very site quite a while ago, I thought I’d rescan it and give you some big ol’ pics. To wit:
A little wear and tear on the button, to be sure, but still a beloved item in the collection just the same. Hopefully I can track down some of those other Marvelman pins at some point…I recently told a pal that I’ve been trying to reduce the amount of knick knack-y detritus in my home, but I have a soft spot for Marvel/Miracleman, and for pinbacks, and especially for the two combined.
Okay, he also has some pog-related questions there, but I’m not quite ready to tackle those yet. However, PTOR has the honor of having the last question from that last Question Time post from all those months ago, and that question is THIS:
“How do you keep on top of Diamond / Previews constant ‘newly announced product’ and ‘just now added-on variants and reprints’ that are announced DAILY (with their own dedicated web pages on the Previews site)?
“I’m just a guy trying to keep up with the solicits of pretty much ONE CHARACTER (Doctor Strange, natch) and the constant newly announced stuff is hard to consistently track.
How do you do it for your entire store’s new inventory?”
It’s actually not as bad as it seems. Yes, there’s a constant stream of emails and announcements and whathaveyou, but when it comes to actually ordering all these different items, there’s generally only one or two places to go.
In the Diamond retailer website, you’ve got the Final Order Cutoffs page, where you can adjust your initial orders on comics and toys and other products from select vendors…generally Marvel, DC, IDW, Dark Horse, Image, Zenescope, and some others. Usually any newly announced variants or reprints from these companies will get listed here. This is the place where, if you noticed that your order of 100 copies of X-Squirrels isn’t selling very well on the rack, and you feel like your pending order of 75 copies of issue #2 is going to be way too much, when that issue shows up in the Final Order Cutoff listings you’ll have your chance to drop those numbers down to the far more reasonable 5 copies you should have ordered in the first place.
Then there’s the Previews Plus order page, where all the new products…not just comics, but pretty much everything Diamond carries…show up for your ordering pleasure. Sometimes there’s overlap with the Final Order Cutoff page, but if there is whatever numbers you may have placed will be shown here too. But generally this is the place where you put in your numbers for new product that didn’t show up in the monthly catalog.
Pretty much all new product that Diamond announces shows up in one place or the other. There are rare exceptions, such as the rush print job DC tried to do on the 2nd print of DC Universe Rebirth. We were told to contact our sales rep directly with orders, as, due to its rushed nature, it would not be in the Final Order Cutoff listings.
Occasionally there are special lists made available for other new products (like offers for some San Diego Comic Con exclusives), which are made obvious to anyone logging into Diamond’s site. Like, literally a banner across the top of the page telling you “HEY, PLACE YER ORDERS ALREADY, SHEESH.” Well, maybe not in those words exactly.
And then there are periodic liquidation sales and other special offers, which either show up in email or just when you go to Diamond’s site, but that’s for previously-available product and not quite as vital, but definitely welcome. You just kinda have to keep an eye out for those.
New product, though…the announcements come all the time, but there’s really only a couple of places to put in your orders, so it’s reasonably easy to keep up on that stuff.
And now that I’ve revealed all these secrets to you, PTOR…I’m afraid I’m going to have to kill you. Nothing personal. But that’s just how it goes in the world…of comics retail.
And new this week at your local funnybook store is the Bill & Ted’s Excellent Comic Book Archives, reprinting the Evan Dorkin comics from a couple o’decades back. If you look closely at the first couple of pages in the book, you’ll see a special thanks to yours truly and my former boss Ralph in there. We helped editor pal Ian obtain some necessary material for this collection, and he was kind enough to give us credit! Almost makes me feel bad for all the terrible things I’ve said about Ian in the past. …Almost.
Enough of that…now let us attend to the last batch of predictions!
• • •
Jeff R. rites
“Of these three, one will see an issue at least for sale in 2015, one will be solicited before the end of the year, and one will have no sign seen: Mage III, Frank Miller’s Xerxes comic, and a brand-new Miracleman comic from Gaiman. (which is to say not counting the one that’s already written and drawn but never published.)”
Just a tad early…this week the Previews comes out containing the solicits for the first new (or rather unpublished) Gaiman and Buckingham Miracleman story, with brand new installments to come!
“Of the 19 remaining First Wave New 52 titles, less that half will make it to the end of 2015 without a cancellation or relaunch and thus be on track to actually reach #52 sometime in 2016.”
Trying to go over the titles gave me a headache, but I think most of the original 2011 launch titles that made it to 2015 made it into 2016, though, again, you may have been a bit early, depending on whatever this alleged “REBIRTH” thing is DC is leading up to.
“For late in the year, well after the movie, Marvel will solicit an event that looks like the return of the Fantastic Four. When it comes out it will actually not just not bring them back but salt the earth, rendering the characters as toxic and unusable as they can possibly manage.”
Maaaaybe another thing that happened in 2016, depending on what you think of the ending of Secret Wars. I don’t believe anything’s been made unusable yet, but we’ll see what goes on in the future!
“The 8-page ‘Attack on Titans vs. Avengers’ storyline that debuted in Japan in Nov/2014 will be reprinted as a backup story in an Avengers comic. This will entice the original author to finish the story.”
Half a hit, since it popped up in the Free Comic Book Day giveaway from Marvel!
“Mike Sterling will franchise out his store to three new locations.”
…Followed shortly by my death.
“Ant-Man won’t do Guardians-sized box office but will bring in a surprising amount of cash for Marvel.”
As discussed previously…no one’s sneezing at Ant-Man half-billion dollar take.
• • •
Hollywood Hogan bars no holds with
“Avengers 2 is a box office disappointment (not a bomb, but does worse than the first one or GOTG) and Marvel proceeds to completely re-tool future movie plans.”
Age of Ultron did almost as well as the first, box office-wise, but hoo boy it wasn’t a good movie. Thankfully Ant-Man cleansed that palate.
“The Marvel comic universe will be rebooted ala the New 52. Major changes are the elimination of the Fantastic Four completely (they never existed in the new universe), Nick Fury having always been Samuel L. Jackson, and the X-Men being shuffled off to an alternate universe where they are the only superheroes. There will be no regular X-Men book published, but they will make cameos.”
That was the rumor, or at least one of them, and honestly I’m surprised they didn’t do this.
“DC’s September event will be a showcase for characters from cancelled titles and writers to go completely crazy. Expect things like Swamp Thing with an H-Dial, Hawk and Dove joining the Blackhawks, and Larfleeze stealing a Mother Box.”
Almost wish they had done this…what would they have to lose, right? But DC kinda/sorta did some different stuff with some new titles, though sadly some of it died off right quite. I mean, who was expecting both a Bat-Mite and a Bizarro series?
• • •
Jay the Ray has his say
“The multiverse will be introduced in an episode of The Flash, when Barry accidentally is trapped on Earth-2 with Jay Garrick. The twist will be that another Earth out there is the cinematic universe – leaving the door open for future crossovers.”
We did get the multiverse, but they haven’t done much with it aside from Earth One and Earth Two interaction. Getting some vague hints and rumors here and there (like with Supergirl), but nothing with the movie universe just yet. Boy, funny the DC went through all the trouble to get rid of the multiverse in their comics way back when, and here we are with the media adaptations bringing it all back.
“Agents of Shield will be cancelled, Agent Carter will be cancelled, ABC/Disney/Marvel will move Daredevil from Netflix to primetime TV to fill the gap, where it will also flop.”
Nope nope nope and nope. Thank goodness!
“Convergence will lead to the September DC event where ‘anything goes.’ Similar to what the All-Star line was supposed to be, it’ll be iconic versions of characters in their own universes, written by top talent.”
If only they did, Jay the Ray…if only they did.
• • •
Travis gets a little randy with
“To capitalize on interest in the upcoming movie, DC Comics will launch a mini-series entitled ‘Batman v Superman’ depicting the two heroes in a legal battle for custody of Gleek.”
Of course the big problem with this is the idea anyone would want Gleek.
“The trend towards ‘realism’ in adaptations of superhero properties will reach its nadir when a realistic take on ‘The Doom Patrol’ is announced, in which none of the characters will have superpowers/be a robot, there will be no villains, and all of the weirdness will be excised.”
Agreed, that would be terrible. Thankfully the trend seems to be toward embracing all the goofy stuff in comics. If there’s ever a Doom Patrol movie/TV show, there’s going to be a freakin’ Robotman in it, I guarantee!
“People will continue to love ‘The Walking Dead’ for some damn reason.”
Well, they got folks invested in the characters, and it’s probably the one continuing property left where you can have zombies and everyone doesn’t go “(sigh) zombies again?” The spin-off they attempted this year didn’t seem to get quite the same positive reaction, so maybe the main Walking Dead series has some special formula that allows it to continue where other zombie shows just sort of shamble along or crumble into nothingness.
“Valiant will start showing cracks from growing too big, too fast without the sales levels to justify it or the movie deals to float them.
“In other words, Valiant will be the new CrossGen. Marvel will get flooded with resumes by December, because DC isn’t in NYC anymore.”
So far, Valiant has shown some restraint…the occasional mini-series here and there, and that “limited variant chase comic” with a story that only appeared in that comic was a little annoying, but otherwise they haven’t gone too overboard. As for the résumé thing…I mean, I think I’ve heard stories about folks trying to switch over to Marvel just so can stay in the same industry and remain in the New York area, but I suspect Marvel’s overrun with résumés anyway, and any “loss of DC” bump would hardly be noticed. I’ll bet you the big résumé jump came when Disney bought ’em.
“Marvel WILL reboot its universe, but mostly for the sake of diversity. The characters who are seen now as ‘place holders’ will be the official new POC characters in the new Marvel Universe. More will be added in. (I’m guessing an Asian Henry Pym and a Latina Wasp.) The Avengers will be the United Nations of the Marvel U.”
As noted, we didn’t get the full reboot, just a bunch of new #1s. There is a little more diversity in the line-up, but not much more than was already there before the wave of relaunches, and in the cases of the Big Characters (like Spider-Man and Captain America) it’s pretty clear that the new versions of the characters will be there alongside the originals, rather than replacing them. All-New All-Different Avengers did turn out to be a team of a lot of the new characters, which seems to be doing okay so far!
“Ant-Man will do very well at the theaters, but since it won’t set any records, the press will declare it a bomb.”
It did do well…did about 500 million dollars more than I expected an Ant-Man film to do. And we’re not at the point where anyone’s declaring any Marvel movie a bomb yet…folks tend to save that kind of talk for DC movies.
• • •
Bret Sector parts out the predictions as follows
“ALL books published by Marvel and DC will tie-in to a larger over-arching group of titles: Avengers, Spider-Man, X-Men, Fantastic Four, Defenders, Batman, Superman, JLA, Green Lantern, and New Gods.”
Not quite yet…we’ll see where DC’s “Rebirth” thing (which supposedly is going to focus on retooling the line to jibe more with the media adaptations) is going.
“Vertigo will cease to exist.”
Hoo boy, if anything, it’s the opposite, to the point where my Vertigo customers are all “man, enough already.”
“Valiant will re-acquire their Gold Key characters.”
I know you can’t go home again, but it’d be nice to see Doctor Solar and X-O Manowar teaming up once more, right?
Prediction: In advance of his introduction to the Marvel Cinematic Universe, Marvel will announce a new Black Panther ongoing series. It will be written by David Walker, current writer of SHAFT from Dynamite Comics.
There is a new Black Panther series coming, but it’s by Ta-Nehisi Coates and Brian Stelfreeze. And, you know, that ain’t bad.
• • •
Old pal Dan Latta slugs me with
“The Marvel reboot won’t be as rebooty as everyone thinks.”
Correct!
“Star Wars VII will be better than the prequels, but not as good as Guardians of the Galaxy was”
I…uh…you know, I can’t really argue that.
“Pictures from Mike’s sordid past as the trumpet player for Saticoy-based 2Tone Ska band will emerge.”
I’ll have you know that our band Ska-mp Thing will hit it big someday!
“Mike Sterling will look to sell something else at his comic shop to attract more customers. It will almost definitely be pogs.”
This will almost certain never happen maybe.
“Around the same time, Ventura County will bear witness to a series of incidents involving a mysterious masked crimefighter who leaves tiny circles of holofoil and cardboard at crime scenes to announce his victories over evil.”
Nobody can prove anything. What are you implying?
“Months after his initial appearance, the masked man appears on TV to reveal himself as…The Night Slammer! California’s first and greatest pog-based superhero, whose exploits are chronicled in his own monthly comic that can only be purchased at Sterling Silver Comics! Business booms, and all the while no one notices how the Night Slammer and Mike Sterling have never been seen together in the same place at the same time.”
okay, maybe
• • •
AND THAT’S THAT. Thanks for participating, everyone…and don’t forget to give me your comic book predictions for 2016! Plus, like I said before, I’ll still respond to some of your comments, and post some corrections, and so on. Thanks for reading, and I’ll be back soon!
Back after a brief hiatus, the End of Civilization returns to warn you what awaits in your local comic shop’s future! Forewarned is four-armed, after all, so crack open your copy of Diamond Previews March 2015 edition and follow along! Also, here’s hoping enough of you read the Dirk Gently novels to know what I’m talking about in my alleged joke for it:
p. 42 – Fight Club 2 #1:
“The Third Rule of Fight Club is that a Fight Club must protect its own existence as long as such protection does not conflict with the First or Second Law.”
OR
“The Third Rule of Fight Club is just keep on talking about Fight Club and its rules, I mean what the hell at this point, right?”
OR
“Um actually there are eight rules of Fight Club, your jokes are dumb”
p. 112 – Convergence: Swamp Thing #2:
So if you’re a big dope like me and just have to be a completist about certain characters, then you end up doing dumb things like buying both the main cover of Convergence: Swamp Thing #2 (the big pic there) and the Chip Kidd-designed “variant” cover (the little inset), even if you think the “variant” is, well, kinda so-so. I mean, maybe when all those variants are up on the rack they’ll give an impression of, well, some kind, but just on its own…I don’t know. I may have poked some slight fun at the design with an image on the Twitters recently:
p. 153 – The Flash Reverse-Flash Ring:
“Hey, I really like your Flash ring!”
“Actually, it’s the Reverse-Flash ring, worn by the Flash’s arch…enemy, um…from the future…uh, yeah, I really like my Flash ring, too.”
p. 155 – Wonder Woman The Art of War Wonder Woman by Robert Valley Statue:
Man, the Lady Apple Bonkers are hot:
ALTERNATE GAG: That statue’s legs are almost as long as the statue’s name.
p. 161 – Dirk Gently’s Holistic Detective Agency #1:
I’m kind of hoping there’s a plotline in the comic about how they have to go back in time to prevent Keven Smith from finishing Daredevil/Bullseye: The Target in order to save the universe.
p. 436 – The Art of the Pimp: One Man’s Search for Love, Sex and Money:
“Dennis Hof, proprietor of the world-famous Moonlite BunnyRanch brothel and the P.T. Barnum of prostitution, charts his path to fame and infamy, while dispensing homespun wisdom about sex, sales, money, and how to live as the country’s most recognizable pimp. In The Art of the Pimp, Dennis Hof offers a hilarious, insightful, behind-the-scenes look at life as the proprietor of The Moonlight BunnyRanch and recounts his chaotic life as the king of America’s sex industry.”
Comics, everyone!
p. 482 – Firefly Jayne Cobb with Hat Legacy Collection Action Figure:
Actually, it’s about ethics in knit caps.
p. 490 – Batman 1966 Dynamic Duo Monolith:
Say, why don’t we have a giant statue for Batman and Robin? Maybe we can just hit Mount Rushmore and slap a cowl on George Washington and a mask on Jefferson…and, I don’t know, dye Roosevelt white and green and put a luchador mask on Lincoln. Just spitballin’ here.
While we think about that, please enjoy Batman’s visit to Rushmore:
p. 492 – Avengers Coulson’s Captain America Trading Card Set II:
So Coulson just had card sets in every pocket while he was runnin’ around doin’ stuff in the Avengers movie? Did he have Force Works pogs in his socks? A Nomad phone card in his wallet?
p. 556 – My Little Pony Rainbow Dash Hooded Throw:
Oh, hey, to go with your Doctor Who pony, your very own Lady Cassandra pony:
p. 558 – Roddenberry Trek Fish Car Emblem:
“What does God need with a bumper sticker?”
p. 559 – Star Wars Darth Vader Comfy Throw Fleece Blanket with Sleeves:
Man, even in the upcoming sequels they’ve found a way to undermine Vader’s villainy.
p. 560 – Zombie Window Buddies Decal Sets:
Sure to delight any nearsighted traffic cops that happen to be in your neighborhood!
Marvel Previews p. 131 – Miles Morales Ultimate Spider-Man Vol. 2 – Revelations TPB:
“I’ve had a theory that in the near future DC and Marvel are going to go the way that ‘Love & Rockets’ has. The elimination of the single issue, 20+page comic (which have become nothing more than chapters of a novel, anyway) to a complete, TPB. It’s my belief that that’s why DC had gone to 52 different titles, so that when they make this transformation, they could offer comic shops a new TPB title every week. (one week a Batman TPB, the next a Green Lantern TPB, the next a Flash TPB, etc…) If the big two went this route how do you think this would effect comic book shops, basically turning them into comic book stores to book stores.”
That could be where we’re headed, but that would certainly result in the end of the direct market as we know (to which some folks would cheer, I’m sure). Comics retail is dependent on the weekly new releases, and the repeat business of regular clientele…plus there is a psychological divide between “buying the latest issue” and “getting the trade” that still exists in the marketplace. DC and Marvel are already playing around with pricier formats that are thicker than your standard comic, but are still periodical-y enough to not seem like trades. DC has that $9.99 format (most recently seen with the Batman ’66: The Lost Episode, and Marvel has been issuing thicker staplebound reprints in the $7.99 format (they’ve released some older Star-Lord comics like this over the last year or so). Perhaps slowly moving their monthlies over to these formats, thicker books with more content (almost by necessity anthologies) and higher price points while still keeping them at least semi-periodical may bridge the gap between increasingly-economically infeasible 20-page comics and occasional trades.
• • •
Michael Grabowski grabs for an answer to this:
“I hope this isn’t too personal, but with regard to those Swamp Thing slippers, or Swampy clothing in general, do you find yourself collecting such items in every size available?”
No, no…usually if it’s something I intend to wear, I’m happy with just getting the size I need. For something like my Swamp Thing slippers, while as much as I’d love to have them in my size, the example set I have is enough. (There is a lot of child-sized Swamp Thing clothing from the early ’90s that, um, I’m probably going to pass on, however. “I was just buying these off eBay for my collection, Your Honor.”)
• • •
Dan randomly asks
“Totally random, my girlfriend was debating about continuing to read Wonder Woman after Azzarello/Chiang.
She had the same reaction as you to the fact that Swamp Thing was in the book (ALMOST as instant buy) but she held off to think about it.
As someone who can’t resist Swamp Thing stories, do you think the issue was worth it to a fan of both WW and Swampy?”
If you’re a crazy person like me who needs every Swamp Thing appearance, then yes. As far as any kind of importance to Swamp Thing’s development as a character…well, it’s no big whoop. It’s interesting as it’s the first time Swampy’s popped up in a Wonder Woman comic, far as I can recall, so if that tickles your fancy, go for it. What’ve you got to lose, other than three bucks? As for Wonder Woman fans…well, it’s the beginning of a new direction for the character, so that’s usually a good time to pop in and see if you like where things are going. Granted, issue #36 is getting some grief in online reviews, but boy, it sure sold well for me at my shop. Your Mileage May Vary, as they say.
“Mike, someone already asked about back issues. My question is, where do you see back issues in 5-10 years? Will younger readers ever want full floppy paper sets of titles like Suicide Squad, Nova or Marvel Two-In One? Will the books be worthless (except for key issues)? Or will there always be some demand for old paper comics?”
You know, I feel like I’ve been doing this blog long enough to think that I’ve probably been asked the “where do you think the back issue market will be in five years” about five years ago. Or even ten years. My honest feeling is that there will always be a market for fairly-priced general back issues, and premium-priced high-demand back issues. The collectibles market for comics is still maintaining, so big-ticket items will continue to move, I think. And just from my years of experience, kids are fascinated by old comics, particularly from before they were born, like from the long-ago ancient times of the early 2000s. Whether they’ll want full runs of things…well, depends on the collector. I’ve got a kid right now looking for all the old Metal Men comics he can get his hands on. So, you know, it’s still theoretically possible. If there’s stuff that’s not selling for what Overstreet is listing it at, there’s always the ol’ bargain boxes…price that stuff down ’til it’s at the cost people are willing to pay.
Anyway, I don’t think the back issue market is going away anytime soon, as long as dealers are smart and careful about it.
“Hi, Mike! Congrats once again on the new store! Speaking of which, all my questions are new store related: 1) Did you feel a professional responsibility to discuss the idea of starting a new store with the owner of Ralph’s/Seth’s before you left to see how the idea would be received? 2) Doesn’t it pose a threat to their business that you might cannibalize some of their loyal customers? 3) Was there some sort of minimum driving distance required separating the two stores to make sure you weren’t invading each other’s turf? Thanks and continued success in your new venture!”
1. Oh, absolutely. I wasn’t going to stab these guys in the back…I’ve had a good working relationship with these guys for years, and, you know, they’re friends. I want to stay on their good sides! Ralph had known for years I’ve been wanting to open my own shop, and when an actual opportunity finally arose, I made sure to tell both Seth and Ralph of my plans.
2. I like to think I’m not posing that much of a threat…yes, a few customers came with me, which was not unexpected by any of us, and that was not an issue. I’m also getting a whole new clientele out in my area, so by and large, while there’s still a way to go, I’m creating a market out here, rather than eating away at the other shop’s customer base. Plus, we’re readily sending customers to each other, so we’re building a community instead of a warzone, which is nice.
3. I personally decided I wanted to be a good distance away from Seth’s/Ralph’s specifically so that I could avoid stepping on any toes. I’m about a half-hour away, which doesn’t seem like a lot, but if you lived out here, you’d see that it is most definitely a different area and a different community, and I believe our shops can easily coexist.
Thanks for the good wishes!
• • •
Alex wants to know
“Late to the party, but are you buying Miracleman in single issues as it is coming out, or is that just for chumps like me? I’m not crazy about what it costs, but I’m only buying a handful of titles these days, so I can take it. It’s a good series, and I’ve avoided spoilers for 20 years.
“I’m one of those who grew up hearing how awesome it was, but I dion’t really care to have it in a nice hardcover collection or anything. Upon reading this particular series, I wouldn’t really want someone to pass by my bookshelf, pull it down and flip through it… there’s a reason it’s coming in polybags, that’s for sure.”
Well, I’m something of a Miracleman enthusiast, so I’m getting the single issues even though I have all the originals, out of completeness’s sake. Plus, I get the new coloring and everything put together in order (as opposed to having to piece some stuff together myself). I still can’t bring myself to part with the originals, however, even though I have a store and I need to feed the back issue bins/display cases with stuff.
I’m still convinced Marvel’s only been polybagging Miracleman comics because…well, you know those murder mysteries where the killer has strong motives for killing person C, but also kills persons A, B and D whom he doesn’t know in order to keep the coppers from immediately suspecting him? Anyway, the all-birth issue of Miracleman, and probably the forthcoming all-super-violent issue, are person C in this scenario. There’s no reason for most issues of MM to be bagged, especially when compared to titles on the stands that aren’t bagged. I really do think they were only bagged so that the issue the birth issue wouldn’t stand out as requiring special attention from those folks who think comics are destroying children’s minds. Well, okay, they are, but you know what I mean.
• • •
Chris Gumprich richly proposes
“1. How many of these questions did you expect to be ‘Swamp Thing’ related?
2. Are you as disappointed as I was that they set an episode of Constantine in Louisiana and yet not one single mention of Houma?”
1. I expected a few. I can only blame myself.
2. I’m more disappointed that I haven’t had a chance to watch Constantine yet. Just no time! I promise, sometime before I die I will watch this series. So, you know, in the next few months.
Also last week I blew someone’s mind by telling him Constantine was a Swamp Thing spin-off character.
• • •
Pogressiveruin‘s biggest fan Crowded House slams down this query:
“How long until you are reduced to selling POGs out back to make ends meet, and how far are you willing to go to keep your shelves stocked with these hot-selling items your customers demand everyday?”
If the public demands POGs, I will sell them POGs. I’m not proud. I’m willing to go as far as Ventura to maintain my stock, because I know there’s plenty still at the old shop.
• • •
And my old friend D Latta wraps it up with
“Would you buy a bar of soap at a garage sale?”
Depends how it tastes.
And that is that, my friends! Thank you for your questions, and I hope my answers were, if not particularly illuminating, at least somewhat entertaining, or at the very least correctly spelled. I’ll try not to let multiple years pass before opening the floor like this again…and heck, if you have any questions you want me to answer in the future, just let me know. You know where to find me.
