The cowl stays on.
Last time, jmurphy brought up
“But the good news is that LCE #51 is being reprinted full size.”
And indeed they are! The Limited Collectors’ Edition #51 treasury edition from 1977 is coming to shelves in a facsimile edition next month, collecting together theh original Ra’s al Ghul saga by Denny O’Neil, Neal Adams. Irv Novick, and Dick Giordano.
The only image I can find on the distributor sites for this facsimile is the one I posted above, showing its original cover. I’m hoping the cover is reproduced authentically, and not “retouched” as they did with 2004 reprint of DC 100 Page Super Spectacular #6 (original / reprint). Or (ahem) “recolored” as some other Adams reprints have been.
I realize I’m probably worrying for nothing, as DC’s facsimile editions of late haven’t had that much after-the-fact fiddling and are presented more-or-less as originally printed. (Though to be fair I haven’t really taken that close a lot to see if the Golden Age facsimiles, like the Superman #1, are the redrawn versions that appeared in the early DC Archives).
The big change of course is getting the material on nice, white paper, versus the newsprint of the originals. Of course, yes, I’ve commented before about the dissonance about seeing work that originally lived on newprint suddenly being all bright and shiny, but having it on those nice, big treasury-sized pages will certainly be welcome and much easier on the ol’ eyeballs.
This will be, I think, DC’s first reprint of a treasury duplicating the original format, versus the treasury-sized hardcover edition they did of Superman Vs. Muhammad Ali (which is Peak Neal Adams Superman in my opinion). There was also a smaller “deluxe edition” hardcover published at the same time, with a new Adams cover and extra bonus material not included in the larger facsimile. I don’t know if the smaller book was given the “recoloring” treatment. Anyway, that story needs to be seen at full size, so I’m not sure why you’d want that “deluxe” version anyway.
But back to this Ra’s al Ghul treasury, which is probably about as good as this particular Bat-villain ever got in print form (outside the frankly demented and evil and great usage in the Batman Beyond cartoon). The treasury includes his first appearance and conflict with Batman, including the famed shirtless (but not cowlless) sword fight:
…and c’mon, if anything deserves to be reprinted on bigger than normal pages, it’s this.
With any luck this facsimile will do well enough to open up more reprints of DC’s treasuries (and spur Marvel along to do the same). It’s obvious why they started with this one (Batman drawn by Neal Adams, duh), but it’d be nice if they brought the Superman Vs. Wonder Woman story drawn by Jose Luis Garcia-Lopez back into print — it did get a treasury-sized hardcover reprint a few years back, but man, it should always be available.
And personally I’d like some of those Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer treasuries just to get more Sheldon Mayer in my life. Not really holding my breath for this to happen, honestly.
I hope future treasury reprints, if any, will focus on the ones with new stories that have only appeared there, versus reprinting books that contain reprints themselves. Not to say that something like this Adams Batman collection isn’t worthwhile, and nice to have on Big Ol’ Pages, but I’d rather have any new material from these show up in its original dimensions rather than being shrunk down.
That’s great that this is coming out soon–and agreed that they should reprint more of the original content Treasury Editions…the wedding of Lightning Lad and Saturn Girl/Superboy and The Legion of Super-Heroes one would be nice to see, and the Superman Vs. Captain Marvel one, as well as the already mentioned Superman Vs. Wonder Woman, and Superman Vs. Muhammad Ali.
But I could also see it being cool to create new reprint Treasury Editions: Wein & Wrightson’s Swamp Thing, O’Neil and Adams’ Green Lantern/Green Arrow, O’Neil and Kaluta’s The Shadow would all be great to see as Treasury Editions for the superlative artwork. Heck, even the Best JLA/JSA Annual team ups would be cool to see reprinted in several Treasury Editions –especially the death of Wing story, the introduction of the Freedom Fighters and Earth-X story, and the Shazam Squadron of Justice and Earth-S story. Some of the best Bruno Premiani-drawn Doom Patrol stories from the Silver Age would be nice to see reprinted as a Treasury, ditto for some of the best Teen Titans stories from the Silver and early Bronze Ages with classic Nick Cardy and George Tuska art. Also “The Untold Origin of the JSA” by Levitz and Staton, and “The Great Darkness Saga” by Levitz and the late, great Keith Giffen. And a best of the Brave and The Bold all Jim Aparo art Treasury would be brave and bold to do.
What’s odd about that DC 100 Page Super Spectacular cover is how Neal Adams drew almost all of the JSA on the back cover, except that, for some reason, he drew Dr. Mid-Nite, The Spectre, and Earth-2 Wonder Woman on the front cover. But then he also drew Earth-1 Wonder Woman and Robin on the back cover. So, there’s a weird dichotomy where both Earth-1 and Earth-2 Robin are on th back cover. I can somewhat understand the rationale behind putting Earth-2 Wonder Woman on the front cover, as Earth-1 Wonder Woman had been de-powered at point and was dressed all in
white, so with Earth-2 Wonder Woman being prominently featured on the front cover there would be the costume
recognition for casual readers which might bump up sales. Also, Johnny Quick is on the back cover, and while he’s a Golden Age Earth-2 character, he was never part of the original JSA…at least pre-COIE…who knows how many times continuity has geen changed since then…but back in my day he was made an All-Star Squadron member, but not a JSA member. Anyway, I find it odd that Carmine Infantino didn’t tell Neal Adams to move The Spectre and Dr. Mid-Nite and Earth-2 Wonder Woman to the back cover along with the rest of the JSA, and move Earth-1 Wonder Woman and Robin, along with Johnny Quick, to the front cover. Also, the recoloring looks really bad on the reprint, but in both cases they incorrectly colored Earth-2 Robin’s fingers as flesh toned instead of as blue gloved.
I’ve still got my original copies of all those editions, but everybody should have a fresh chance to read these things at reasonable rates.
Also in my stash is a treasury-sized book DC never printed in the first place, but Internet rumor figures they now have the rights to: Kirby’s adaptation of 2001. Given this series contains some of Kirby’s very best work, the greedy-side of me hopes they’ll reprint the -entire- series in the treasury size. Or is that like hoping HAL will open the pod-bay door?
“I’ve still got my original copies of all those editions, but everybody should have a fresh chance to read these things at reasonable rates.”
That’s the catch here. When the Supes vs. Ali reprint came out, it was about the same price if not more than buying the original. I forget exactly, but I know that’s why I skipped it.
I’m normally a collected edition over originals guy, but reprinting a singular issue isn’t a collected edition. So why am I going to pay as much or more for a reprint than an original of a single issue?
José Villarrubia has an image album on Facebook called “From a colorist’s perspective” where he compares original comics colours with new reprints and (in some cases) what he would do to if he was asked to recolour it. It’s really neat and worth checking out.
Both Marvel and DC (and maybe other companies) have printed a lot of facsimile editions over the last few years. Why do you think they’ve been successful?
@Garrie Burr
Marvel or DC should definitely reprint a Treasury Edition of Kirby’s 2001 adaptation. Marvel should also reprint a Treasury Edition of Jack Kirby’s Captain America’s Bicentenial Battles. Beyond that, they should reprint certain key stories or runs in Treasury Editions. The whole Cockrum/Byrne X-Men run would be great to see reprinted sequentially in a series of Treasury Editions–maybe they could even get Byrne to draw new covers. Or, if not the whole run, then celebrated stories like “Days of Future Past.” Frank Miller’s Daredevil run, Steranko’s three issues of Captain America and his Nick Fury stories, The Kree-Skrull War, Frank Brunner’s Doctor Strange run, Jim Starlin’s Captain Marvel,and Adam Warlock runs…all would look great in Treasury
Editions. And, of course, they could always trot out Roy Thomas and Howard Chaykin’s Star Wars adaptation in Treasury Editions again…and why not rerelease the Battlestar Galactica Treasury Edition…and Micronauts no. 1-12 is definitely worthy of Treasury Edition treatment.
@ Matthew Murray
I find that generally I like the original coloring better than recoloring… especially if the original colorist was Tatjana Wood, Marie Severin, or Tom Palmer, who were all amazing colorists. I was not a fan at all of Neal Adams changing things when some of his DC stories were reprinted recently.
One thing I would like to see, however, is Mike Royer reinking Kirby’s art on the first few issues of New Gods/Forever People/Jimmy Olson/Mister Miracle which Vince Coletta originally inked.
If they ever do reprint the movie adaptation of “2001” I pray that somebody finally straightens out the big mistake Kirby made of drawing Bowman with his helmet already on when he has to go around HAL to get back into the ship. The whole point of Bowman having to fire the explosive bolts was because he had to get back on the Discovery fast since he didn’t have his helmet on. I’ve always wondered if Marvel had any proof-readers who should have spotted that mistake. The editor really screwed that up.
Great Treasury Edition suggestions here. Not surprised to see all the love for these oversized wonders. How about Moore’s Saga of the Swamp Thing? Imagine Bissette and Totleben’s detailed art on those big pages. I would also love to see BWS Conan and some Kubert/Heath Sgt. Rock reprinted in the larger format. The trend these days seems to be reprinting classic comics in a smaller format. I wonder if publishers aren’t missing out on an untapped revenue source here.
In “The Comics Journal” link there’s a mention of the removal of Marvel’s two volume Captain America because of “mischevious” artwork. What was that all about?
““But the good news is that LCE #51 is being reprinted full size.””
AWESOME!!!!
“Or is that like hoping HAL will open the pod-bay door?”
“I can’t let you do that, Dave.”
“Mike Royer reinking Kirby’s art on the first few issues of New Gods/Forever People/Jimmy Olson/Mister Miracle which Vince Coletta originally inked”
OK, yes, that would be an OBVIOUS improvement.
“there’s a mention of the removal of Marvel’s two volume Captain America because of “mischevious” artwork”
I think someone snuck a swear word in? I can’t remember.
@ JohnJ
That makes me wonder if Marvel would have Chaykin or somebody redraw Jabba and also make sure not to color Darth Vader’s mask green if the Star Wars film adaptation gets reprinted as a Treasury Edition.
@ExistentialMan
Good suggestions! I totally think Marvel and DC are missing out on untapped revenue sources by not publishing Treasury Editions of classic stories on a regular basis. They really ought to diversify their publishing strategies…I would think that many Gen X and Boomer readers would buy these Treasury Editions– along with some younger readers who are interested in the history of certain characters or classic story arcs. Also, DC in particular has absorbed so many other companies, that they are missing out on opportunities to reprint classic Steve Ditko Captain Atom, Blue Beetle, and The Question stories, or tons of great stories originally published by Quality Comics with art by the amazing Lou Fine, Reed Crandall, Bill Ward, Will Eisner, and Jack Cole. One or more Jack Cole Treasury Editions featuring some classic Plasticman and Midnight stories would be great. A compilation Freedom Fighters Treasury Edition featuring some of the best Quality Comics solo stories of Doll-Man, The Ray, The Human Bomb, Black Condor, Phantom Lady, Uncle Sam, and Firebrand, as well as their first appearance as a team in “Crisis on Earth -X” would be cool. Also, a Treasury Edition featuring all of the prominent Fawcett Comics characters– the Marvel Family, Spy Smasher, Bulletman and Bulletgirl, Mr. Scarlet and Pinky, Ibis, Golden Arrow, Commando Yank, Phantom Eagle, Minuteman, etc. DC is sitting on a wealth of comics history material that they should be curating and reprinting in Treasury Editions for $15 a pop or less…instead of just releasing old material in
omnibuses.
@Matthew M
“Both Marvel and DC (and maybe other companies) have printed a lot of facsimile editions over the last few years. Why do you think they’ve been successful?”
I think there’s a cool factor getting ib older facsimile editions, where there’s multiple stories (most of which aren’t often reprinted) like Detective 27 and AF #15, and seeing the classic stories in context. I’m mystified about the the more recent editions, where the originals aren’t even that expensive if you want to see the ads (ie Secret Wars and Crisis).
@Sean
“I totally think Marvel and DC are missing out on untapped revenue sources by not publishing Treasury Editions of classic stories on a regular basis. They really ought to diversify their publishing strategies…I would think that many Gen X and Boomer readers would buy these Treasury Editions– along with some younger readers who are interested in the history of certain characters or classic story arcs.”
Do you really think they’re going to sell better than standard size or the slightly larger OHC format they both use? Nostalgia can be a heck of thing, but the treasury format is harder store, is going to cost more for less, and is harder to keep in good shape.
“Also, DC in particular has absorbed so many other companies, that they are missing out on opportunities to reprint classic Steve Ditko Captain Atom, Blue Beetle, and The Question stories”
DC did two Archives of this material as The Action Heroes Archive.
At least some Captain Atom Charlton stories seem to have fallen into the public domain, since PS Artbooks has a preorder up for a Captain Atom collection.
One of the books DC cancelled was a Captain Comet Archives that reprinted from his first appearance. I actually placed an order for a copy. Does anybody else have a book they ordered that the Big Two cancelled??
How about the way they both did away with their black and white reprint collections, Marvel Essentials and DC Showcase Presents. They both lasted a long time to suddenly get dropped.
They both should be reprinting books featuring their classic artists. I’m been hoping for a Gil Kane “Rex, the Wonder Dog” collection backed up by Carmine Infantino’s “Detective Chimp”!!
@JohnJ: I miss the cheap B&W reprint books. They were an amazing bargain, and I liked seeing the art sans color. I suppose Marvel Unlimited & DC Infinite make most reprint lines obsolete, but I prefer paper to screens.
@JohnJ
I’ve lost track of how many collected editions I’ve preordered from DC that they’ve cancelled. The main ones I remembered are the first two volumes of Ostrander’s Suicide Squad (if nothing else, I am forever grateful to the first film for prodding DC to go beyond the first trade) and the DC Library HC of the Monster Society of Evil. I didn’t actually preorder the second HC of Priest’s Black Adam run, but that surprised me alot.
The really scary cancellation though was when they recently cancelled a bunch of TPB editions of contemporary Batman material, which at least had already come out in HC, but if DC is cancelling modern Batman TPBs due to low preorders, there’s nothing they won’t cancel.
I actually acquired this at the Super Friends water show at Sea World. I remember they were handing out Treasury Editions outside the arena after the show (I think they were free). I initially picked Superman vs. Muhammad Ali (or more likely, my parents picked it out) and I made us go back and swap it out for the Batman, little knowing I was about to read my first not completely kid-friendly comic book. My main exposure to DC had been the cartoons, so this blew my young mind.
Andrew:
I posted about it on Twitter in the middle of last year (with pics that may Not Be Safe for Work):
https://twitter.com/mikesterling/status/1637188222429302785
https://twitter.com/mikesterling/status/1641672757116280832
and it dawns on me you may not be able to read this unless you have a Twitter account. I’ll try to repost on the main site here soon.
…in short, someone in production drew an eightball on the bald head of a bad guy, and drew private parts on Bucky. Just what Marvel wanted to discover in their high-end hardcover slipcase Cap reprints.
Thanks Mike. I bet those copies are worth a bundle by now. (I do have a Twitter account.)
Andrew: oh, okay, good, I can’t keep track of what accounts *I* have, much less what everybody else has!
In truth, those books don’t actually sell for very much. The controversy is long forgotten except by creaky fossils like me, and there just doesn’t seem to be the demand for this material like there used to be. I think I ended up selling the set for…$60, maybe? It’s been a bit, so I don’t recall.
“How about the way they both did away with their black and white reprint collections, Marvel Essentials and DC Showcase Presents.”
It was odd to me they dropped those!
“and drew private parts on Bucky.”
Snicker!
@ Matthew M.
I think the facsimile editions have been successful because a certain demographic isn’t really that into modern Marvel and DC Comics and would rather spend money on classic stories primarily published during the Golden, Silver, and Bronze Ages of comics. Also, during COVID, the prices of older classic comics and any comics considered potential “keys” (due to rampant potential or confirmed film/streaming series
adaptations speculation) went through the roof. Even though the market has cooled since then, many fans still don’t want to spend outrageous sums of money for older comics, and some readers prefer so-called “floppies” to omnibuses.
I also agree with Joe G.’s point about seeing the classic stories in context. Ever since I read the Steranko History of Comics volumes 1 and 2, I’ve been fascinated by the Golden Age of Comics and wanted to be able to see as many Golden Age Comics as possible. At this point they are historical artifacts, even if many of them were also propaganda. But whether it is a Golden, Silver, or Bronze Age comics, it is neat to see a faithful reprint of that comic, complete with the letter columns, advertisements, etc. from the era in which that comic was published. How cool is it to read a facsimile edition reprint of a Silver Age comic and find a fan letter that Marv Wolfman or Martin Pasko or somebody who eventually became a comics professional wrote when they were young. Or how cool is it to read a fan letter written by T.M. Maple in a facsimile edition
of a 1980s comic?
I think the bigger question is why don’t Marvel and DC bother to have letter pages anymore, or at least run house ads for official websites to write to letting them know what content/facsimile editions readers are interested in having reprinted. They could even have Diamond send surveys to comics shops that people could fill out. One would think if enough Gen X or Boomer collectors are willing to pay for certain facsimile editions, Marvel and DC cold customize the orders. One would also think that they would be printing Treasury Editions, and also Digests. I thought it was cool in the ’80s when DC had Adventure Comics as a Digest. Classicand “evergreen” content shims be in print in as many formats as possible…black and white, trades, omnibuses, facsimile editions, Treasury Editions, Digests, and curated artist editions for artists of historical significance to comics history including Joe Kubert, Alex Toth, Jack Kirby, Neal Adams, Carmine Infantino, Russ Heath, Bernie Wrightson, George Perez, Nick Cardy, Gil Kane, Frank Miller, John Byrne, and so on.
@ Matthew M.
I think the facsimile editions have been successful because a certain demographic isn’t really that into modern Marvel and DC Comics and would rather spend money on classic stories primarily published during the Golden, Silver, and Bronze Ages of comics. Also, during COVID, the prices of older classic comics and any comics considered potential “keys” (due to rampant potential or confirmed film/streaming series
adaptations speculation) went through the roof. Even though the market has cooled since then, many fans still don’t want to spend outrageous sums of money for older comics, and some readers prefer so-called “floppies” to omnibuses.
I also agree with Joe G.’s point about seeing the classic stories in context. Ever since I read the Steranko History of Comics volumes 1 and 2, I’ve been fascinated by the Golden Age of Comics and wanted to be able to see as many Golden Age Comics as possible. At this point they are historical artifacts, even if many of them were also propaganda. But whether it is a Golden, Silver, or Bronze Age comics, it is neat to see a faithful reprint of that comic, complete with the letter columns, advertisements, etc. from the era in which that comic was published. How cool is it to read a facsimile edition reprint of a Silver Age comic and find a fan letter that Marv Wolfman or Martin Pasko or somebody who eventually became a comics professional wrote when they were young. Or how cool is it to read a fan letter written by T.M. Maple in a facsimile edition
of a 1980s comic?
I think the bigger question is why don’t Marvel and DC bother to have letter pages anymore, or at least run house ads for official websites to write to letting them know what content/facsimile editions readers are interested in having reprinted. They could even have Diamond send surveys to comics shops that people could fill out. One would think if enough Gen X or Boomer collectors are willing to pay for certain facsimile editions, Marvel and DC cold customize the orders. One would also think that they would be printing Treasury Editions, and also Digests. I thought it was cool in the ’80s when DC had Adventure Comics as a Digest. Classic and “evergreen” content shims be in print in as many formats as possible…black and white, trades, omnibuses, facsimile editions, Treasury Editions, Digests, and curated artist editions for artists of historical significance to comics history including Joe Kubert, Alex Toth, Jack Kirby, Neal Adams, Carmine Infantino, Russ Heath, Bernie Wrightson, George Perez, Nick Cardy, Gil Kane, Frank Miller, John Byrne, and so on.
“a certain demographic”
Finally! I’m a demographic!
“prices of older classic comics… went through the roof”
Seriously!
“and some readers prefer so-called “floppies” to omnibuses.”
Omnis are SO expensive… and some of us just want a certain writers or artists run on a title, rather than thirty consecutive issues with two or three different writers.
I DID just buy the first ROM omni, though!
“why don’t Marvel and DC bother to have letter pages anymore”
My 3 guesses: They’d rather run an ad and get revenue, laziness, or not enough people write in.